Comment on Jewish concept of Messiah (Christ) is identical to our Christian concept of Anti-Messiah (Anti-Christ), brief comparison of Orthodox Judaism and Orthodox Christianity by Jacob.
As you pointed out Wes, in Daniel it refers to the Kingdom as belonging to both, but it does not indicate that the Son of Man is both a singular and a plural. This is completely consistent with New Testamental teaching.
Your understanding of the Jewish teaching on Satan (in which Satan is a willing agent of the Almighty) is not the historical Jewish understanding. It in no way reflects, for example, pre-Christian Judaic understandings of Satan as demonstrated in the ancient Jewish texts of the 1st century BC nor does it jive with the Jewish practice of exorcism which is both current and ancient.
Even so, you misunderstand (again) Christian teaching. Christian teaching is not that God and Satan are struggling against eachother. Rather, the teaching is that God is already victorious (how could it be any other way) and that Satan, having rejected God, realizes this but wants to draw as many people away from God as possible. God, in His boundless wisdom and love for His creation, allows us to be tempted in order to grow spiritually (as in the case of Job which you mentioned)
Of course God cannot die. Yes, this is basic. This is one of the foundational reasons of how Jesus’ death accomplished for us the end of death. When Jesus died, death came face to face with Life. God is Life and Light, and in Him is no death.
Again, with the preacher guy, you are not discussing the Orthodox Christian faith. When God looks at us, He sees us. We will be judged according to our deeds. We don’t even believe half of the stuff you’re arguing against. The prosperity Gospel is not Christian, it is delusional.
Jesus accomplished everything you described. He did rebuild the temple, He gathered in Israel, He restored True worship of the one True God to all nations. He left nothing unaccomplished. If you want to understand how this is so, you will have to open your mind and put forward some effort to get to know the teachings and life of the Orthodox Church.
The different denominations you speak of are irrelevant since they are not representative of the Apostolic Faith. The Orthodox Church has taught exactly the same Faith from the Apostles to our present day. The Orthodox Church is not a denomination, it is the Body of Christ, which is the creation united to the Creator. The first members of the Orthodox Church were the Holy Angels when they were created.
I could go on and on addressing each one of your points, but honestly you just don’t know what Christianity teaches. Even if it’s just so you can at least know what you’re talking about, I would strongly recommend you go an check out a few books on Orthodox Christianity. You will be surprised at how similar Judaism and true Christianity are.
Jacob Also Commented
Jewish concept of Messiah (Christ) is identical to our Christian concept of Anti-Messiah (Anti-Christ), brief comparison of Orthodox Judaism and Orthodox Christianity
Also with regards to the stoning, I could be wrong but I don’t think that the woman in question was tried according to the standards of the law. It appears to be sort of a mob action more than a carrying out of justice. It’s worth notice that according to the rabbinic teaching on the Sanhedrin, it was nearly impossible for them to put someone to death. So the stoning of the adulterous woman seems inconsistent with the rabbinic teaching on the Jewish code of Justice and the Jewish ethical requirements of a Sanhedrin (which don’t seem to even appear in the story indicated that the woman probably didn’t even get a trial… although I am not sure if women were afforded the same legal protection as men in actual practice at that time).
I understand your frustration, and a lot of what you’re saying makes sense (especially the part about apparently God giving the Law when the Hebrew people didn’t stand a chance, even though the text explicitly says that it is within reach).
However, your post also indicates that despite everything I’ve said, you are still arguing with things that the Orthodox Church simply doesn’t teach, for example your statement above about us not being held accountable for our lawlessness.
I have spent a long time learning Jewish teaching, from the Jewish sources, reading different commentaries, listening to rabbis speak, even going to classes. Obviously I am not an Orthodox Jew, so I do not understand as well as someone who is in that type of community, but I think I have a very good foundational understanding of Judaism and how Jews understand themselves, God, and the Torah.
No one here was spitting on Judaism, which in my opinion has a long and noble tradition of serious thought and scholarship which would make the discussion here much more productive. The author of the post was simply comparing our teaching of the messiah with yours. This is not a judgemental statement, but a theological (and maybe speculative?) one.
As for your statement about ‘all of Christianity’ being right, I think you are being a little unfair here. Suppose some random person stood up in the park and said, “Judaism teaches that UFOs came to earth and sent the Torah to Israel as a joke”, and another Jew said that that is ridiculous, would you think it fair for someone else to say, “no, either all of Judaism is correct, or none of it is”? Clearly, the UFO fanatic is not representing Judaism. So in terms of what ‘Christianity’ teaches, one must first figure out who is actually qualified and authoritative to speak on such issues. Even then, there is some wiggle room for personal opinions, as there is in the observant Jewish communities today. I’m convinced that the Orthodox Church is the Apostolic Church and is therefore the authentic representative of Jesus’ teachings.
I think that you may be right about the debate going on here. Perhaps it is unfruitful. It would probably be better to be humble and ask God to show us reality and the truth. I am not offended that you think Christianity is Pagan. That is your theological opinion. I do think however that it is possible to discuss these things in a fruitful way (though this is probably more difficult over the internet).
I am glad that you find life in the commandments. I pray that God will grant you a greater abundance of life, peace, and joy, and that God continues to draw all of us more and more into the Truth of who He really is.
Best,
Jacob
Jewish concept of Messiah (Christ) is identical to our Christian concept of Anti-Messiah (Anti-Christ), brief comparison of Orthodox Judaism and Orthodox Christianity
Wes nothing you’re saying is new. read this: http://www.orthodoxytoday.org/articles2/PelphreyChristmasP2.php
